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+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <TITLE> [Nel] Subscribe Me</TITLE>
+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:brandon_425%40yahoo.com">
+
+ <LINK REL="Next" HREF="000393.html">
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <H1>[Nel] Subscribe Me</H1>
+ <B>Brandon</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:brandon_425%40yahoo.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] Subscribe Me">brandon_425@yahoo.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Thu, 5 Apr 2001 10:19:11 -0700 (PDT)</I>
+ <P><UL>
+
+ <LI> Next message: <A HREF="000393.html">[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</A></li>
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+ </UL>
+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>
+
+
+__________________________________________________
+Do You Yahoo!?
+Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.
+<A HREF="http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/">http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/</A>
+
+</pre>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000393.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000393.html
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+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <TITLE> [Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</TITLE>
+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:brandon_425%40yahoo.com">
+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000392.html">
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+ <H1>[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</H1>
+ <B>Brandon</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:brandon_425%40yahoo.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net">brandon_425@yahoo.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Thu, 5 Apr 2001 11:24:17 -0700 (PDT)</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000392.html">[Nel] Subscribe Me</A></li>
+ <LI> Next message: <A HREF="000394.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A></li>
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+ </LI>
+ </UL>
+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Mark,
+
+I noticed that you had reflexnet.net also as your ISP. I can't
+believe they pulled the carpet right out from under us and went
+bankrupt. Technology is funny these days. Just like the stock
+market. Ouch!!! :) Funny huh? I found a great new ISP, let me
+know if you want the info or if you could give me some help
+finding a new ISP.
+
+Thanks,
+
+Brandon
+<A HREF="mailto:brandon_425@yahoo.com">brandon_425@yahoo.com</A>
+Home: 503.605.5433
+
+
+--- <A HREF="mailto:nel-request@nevrax.org">nel-request@nevrax.org</A> wrote:
+&gt;<i> Welcome to the <A HREF="mailto:Nel@nevrax.org">Nel@nevrax.org</A> mailing list!
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> To post to this list, send your email to:
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> <A HREF="mailto:nel@nevrax.org">nel@nevrax.org</A>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> General information about the mailing list is at:
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> <A HREF="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel</A>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> If you ever want to unsubscribe or change your options (eg,
+</I>&gt;<i> switch to
+</I>&gt;<i> or from digest mode, change your password, etc.), visit your
+</I>&gt;<i> subscription page at:
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I><A HREF="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/options.cgi/nel/brandon_425@yahoo.com">http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/options.cgi/nel/brandon_425@yahoo.com</A>
+&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> You can also make such adjustments via email by sending a
+</I>&gt;<i> message to:
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> <A HREF="mailto:Nel-request@nevrax.org">Nel-request@nevrax.org</A>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> with the word `help' in the subject or body (don't include the
+</I>&gt;<i> quotes), and you will get back a message with instructions.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> You must know your password to change your options (including
+</I>&gt;<i> changing
+</I>&gt;<i> the password, itself) or to unsubscribe. It is:
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+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> If you forget your password, don't worry, you will receive a
+</I>&gt;<i> monthly
+</I>&gt;<i> reminder telling you what all your nevrax.org mailing list
+</I>&gt;<i> passwords
+</I>&gt;<i> are, and how to unsubscribe or change your options. There is
+</I>&gt;<i> also a
+</I>&gt;<i> button on your options page that will email your current
+</I>&gt;<i> password to
+</I>&gt;<i> you.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> You may also have your password mailed to you automatically
+</I>&gt;<i> off of the
+</I>&gt;<i> Web page noted above.
+</I>
+
+__________________________________________________
+Do You Yahoo!?
+Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.
+<A HREF="http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/">http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/</A>
+
+</pre>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
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+ <P><UL>
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000394.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000394.html
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+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
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+ <TITLE> [Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</TITLE>
+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:robert%40thatsnice.org">
+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000393.html">
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+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <H1>[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</H1>
+ <B>robert@thatsnice.org</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:robert%40thatsnice.org"
+ TITLE="[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?">robert@thatsnice.org</A><BR>
+ <I>Sun, 8 Apr 2001 08:47:53 -0700 (PDT)</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000393.html">[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</A></li>
+ <LI> Next message: <A HREF="000395.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A></li>
+ <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B>
+ <a href="date.html#394">[ date ]</a>
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+ </LI>
+ </UL>
+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Hello again Nevrax folks,
+
+I'm still interested in using NeL in a project, and I wanted to prod
+you guys and see how things are coming along, and when we'll be able
+to get involved again.
+
+Don't forget that one of the selling points of free software is
+collaboration with the community. We're not just here to bug you. :)
+
+Hope everything's going well.
+
+Robert
+
+--
+Robert de Forest &quot;Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day;
+System Administrator set him on fire and he'll be warm
+Got.net for the rest of his life.&quot;
+&lt;<A HREF="mailto:robert@got.net">robert@got.net</A>&gt; -- The Cube, forum3000.org
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
+ <HR>
+ <P><UL>
+ <!--threads-->
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000393.html">[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</A></li>
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000395.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000395.html
new file mode 100644
index 00000000..fbb8d5f1
--- /dev/null
+++ b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000395.html
@@ -0,0 +1,70 @@
+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <TITLE> [Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</TITLE>
+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:valignat%40nevrax.com">
+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000394.html">
+ <LINK REL="Next" HREF="000396.html">
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <H1>[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</H1>
+ <B>Cedric Valignat</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:valignat%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?">valignat@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Mon, 9 Apr 2001 18:52:53 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000394.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A></li>
+ <LI> Next message: <A HREF="000396.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A></li>
+ <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B>
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+ </LI>
+ </UL>
+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Hello Robert,
+
+<A HREF="mailto:robert@thatsnice.org">robert@thatsnice.org</A> wrote:
+&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Don't forget that one of the selling points of free software is
+</I>&gt;<i> collaboration with the community. We're not just here to bug you. :)
+</I>
+hehe ... i think that we quite aware of that :-)
+
+We are just meeting some of our own internal Milestones so, as you guess,
+we are quite busy at the moment.
+
+Our 3D team are redisigning NeL's 3d interfaces, the network is redisigning
+the networks layers, and are curently working on the documentation too ...
+
+A new version of Snowball sould be done for the first of May. That new
+version will use the new network and 3D implementation of NeL.
+
+So don't worry, we didn't forget you, it's just that we are very busy.
+
+Sorry about that ...
+
+
+Cedric.
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
+ <HR>
+ <P><UL>
+ <!--threads-->
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000394.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A></li>
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000396.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000396.html
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+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <TITLE> [Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</TITLE>
+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:David.Mentre%40inria.fr">
+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000395.html">
+ <LINK REL="Next" HREF="000398.html">
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <H1>[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</H1>
+ <B>David Mentre</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:David.Mentre%40inria.fr"
+ TITLE="[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?">David.Mentre@inria.fr</A><BR>
+ <I>10 Apr 2001 09:17:41 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000395.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A></li>
+ <LI> Next message: <A HREF="000398.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A></li>
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+ </LI>
+ </UL>
+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Cedric Valignat &lt;<A HREF="mailto:valignat@nevrax.com">valignat@nevrax.com</A>&gt; writes:
+
+&gt;<i> Our 3D team are redisigning NeL's 3d interfaces, the network is redisigning
+</I>&gt;<i> the networks layers, and are curently working on the documentation too ...
+</I>
+About the network layer, what is the design you have finally chosen?
+Automata over kernel threads?
+
+BTW, have you setup unit tests? I had a (very) quick glance at code but
+did not found any. Would you be interested in such tests?
+
+d.
+--
+ <A HREF="mailto:David.Mentre@inria.fr">David.Mentre@inria.fr</A> -- <A HREF="http://www.irisa.fr/prive/dmentre/">http://www.irisa.fr/prive/dmentre/</A>
+ Opinions expressed here are only mine.
+
+</pre>
+
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000397.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000397.html
new file mode 100644
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+++ b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000397.html
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+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
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+ <TITLE> [Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</TITLE>
+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
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+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000398.html">
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+ </HEAD>
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+ <H1>[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</H1>
+ <B>sameh chafik Pro</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:chafik%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?">chafik@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Tue, 10 Apr 2001 10:01:48 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000398.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A></li>
+ <LI> Next message: <A HREF="000399.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about,
+ right?</A></li>
+ <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B>
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+ </LI>
+ </UL>
+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Hello Robert
+
+&gt;<i> I'm still interested in using NeL in a project, and I wanted to prod
+</I>&gt;<i> you guys and see how things are coming along, and when we'll be able
+</I>&gt;<i> to get involved again.
+</I>
+What kind of project you are working on ?
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
+ <HR>
+ <P><UL>
+ <!--threads-->
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+ right?</A></li>
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+</body></html>
diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000398.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000398.html
new file mode 100644
index 00000000..b9b5a28a
--- /dev/null
+++ b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000398.html
@@ -0,0 +1,72 @@
+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <TITLE> [Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</TITLE>
+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:archer%40nevrax.com">
+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000396.html">
+ <LINK REL="Next" HREF="000397.html">
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <H1>[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</H1>
+ <B>Vincent Archer</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:archer%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?">archer@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Tue, 10 Apr 2001 16:35:06 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000396.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A></li>
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+ </LI>
+ </UL>
+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>According to David Mentre:
+&gt;<i> Cedric Valignat &lt;<A HREF="mailto:valignat@nevrax.com">valignat@nevrax.com</A>&gt; writes:
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; Our 3D team are redisigning NeL's 3d interfaces, the network is redisigning
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; the networks layers, and are curently working on the documentation too ...
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> About the network layer, what is the design you have finally chosen?
+</I>&gt;<i> Automata over kernel threads?
+</I>
+We're finishing the design docs, which will explain exactly how we're
+going to work. Can't explain further yet. You'll have to wait a little bit
+more for these to appear on the web/CVS.
+
+&gt;<i> BTW, have you setup unit tests? I had a (very) quick glance at code but
+</I>&gt;<i> did not found any. Would you be interested in such tests?
+</I>
+We haven't any formal test system for elementary modules. There are some
+self-contained examples in the nel/samples directory that show how some
+modules work, and which could easily be turned into testbeds to check
+functionality.
+
+If you think you can find better examples, or put added examples that
+can serve as tests at the same time, your contribution will be well
+appreciated.
+
+--
+Vincent Archer Email: <A HREF="mailto:archer@nevrax.com">archer@nevrax.com</A>
+
+Nevrax France. Off on the yellow brick road we go!
+
+</pre>
+
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+ <H1>[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about,
+ right?</H1>
+ <B>robert@thatsnice.org</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:robert%40thatsnice.org"
+ TITLE="[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about,
+ right?">robert@thatsnice.org</A><BR>
+ <I>Tue, 10 Apr 2001 15:35:01 -0700 (PDT)</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>[ Charset ISO-8859-1 unsupported, converting... ]
+&gt;<i> Hello Robert
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; I'm still interested in using NeL in a project, and I wanted to prod
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; you guys and see how things are coming along, and when we'll be able
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; to get involved again.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> What kind of project you are working on ?
+</I>
+Why a 3d MUD, of course.
+
+I started out on a MOO, then got into ColdMUD, which then begat this
+project:
+
+coldstore.sourceforge.net
+
+Which is just the back-end, and is embrionic still.
+
+My goal is to replace all the MMORPGs with a decentralized free
+alternative. Of course, this would compete with Nevrax, but that will
+just encourage them to be better. :)
+
+I think Nevrax has the best philosophical approach to this problem of
+any commercial effort, and I applaud them. However, since I don't
+work there, and I still want to work on these problems, I work for
+free.
+
+The particular subject I wish to tackle with an MMORPG is the social
+experimentation subject. This has been tried before in text-based
+adventures (LambdaMOO and its descendents), but never on a large
+enough scale or with new technology.
+
+I want to see if we can learn something as a culture by creating a
+super dynamic world with maximum &quot;player&quot; input into the universe and
+maybe solve some of our differences inside that world. Then maybe we
+can carry those lessons to the outside world.
+
+My experiment would NOT be a game. It would also not be a pure
+simulation because we just don't have that technology yet, either in
+input and output or in resources to process or computer it. It would
+be a rough analogy of life, and would try to put everyone at roughly
+the same level of world interaction, within reason. It would be based
+heavily on life as we know it, but with an accelerated time scale.
+
+I try not to think too much about whether I actually expect this to
+ever happen or be popular. :)
+
+Thanks for asking!
+
+Robert
+
+--
+Robert de Forest &quot;Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day;
+System Administrator set him on fire and he'll be warm
+Got.net for the rest of his life.&quot;
+&lt;<A HREF="mailto:robert@got.net">robert@got.net</A>&gt; -- The Cube, forum3000.org
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
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+ <H1>[Nel] proposed control changes</H1>
+ <B>Dan Erikson</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:derikson%40montana.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] proposed control changes">derikson@montana.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Thu, 12 Apr 2001 20:49:18 -0600</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+ right?</A></li>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Hi all, this is kind of long, sorry. I had some thoughts that I'd like to
+get some feedback on, and some code that you might find useful.
+
+I've put together a patch that changes the mouse control in snowballs so
+that the mouse is normally free, and you have to click on the window
+and move the mouse in order to move the view around. This is a change
+from the current behavior where the mouse is always locked by the
+application. This allows one to use other applications while the game
+is running. I've even used it to have two instances of snowball running at
+the same time, which should be useful for testing reasons. It'll also alow
+for using the mouse in the future for clicking on controls on other parts of
+the screen. The only thing I'm not sure about is how well it will work on
+windows. It looks like it'll work, but it would be nice if someone
+would test it.
+
+I used the right mouse button because the left mouse button is already
+in use
+for throwing a snowball, but I think these changes to the controls would
+work better:
+
+* Left mouse button to move the view around
+* Right mouse button to move forward
+* Space button to throw a snowball
+* Enter button to enter chat mode
+ After text is typed and enter is pressed, return from chat mode
+* Mousewheel forward to zoom in
+* Mousewheel backwards to zoom out
+* Left button turns the view left normally
+* If control+left or left_mouse+left, then strafe left
+* Right button turns the view right normally
+* If control+right or left_mouse+right, then strafe right
+
+The normal mode/chat mode allows us to use the keys for functionality rather
+than F1-F12, which is a little harder to remember than something like
+'r' for
+toggle radar. Also, there are a limited number of function buttons, so I
+think having access to all the other keys would allow good future expansion.
+
+The changes to the mouse buttons allows one to move around the world using
+only the mouse.
+
+It would also be nice to have the ability to customize these keys, but
+that's
+something for a little later.
+
+If anyone has any comments about this stuff, I'd love to hear them.
+
+Patch to use right mouse button to move the heading around:
+
+Index: move_listener.cpp
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /home/cvsroot/code/client/src/move_listener.cpp,v
+retrieving revision 1.23
+diff -c -r1.23 move_listener.cpp
+*** move_listener.cpp 2001/04/10 10:20:48 1.23
+--- move_listener.cpp 2001/04/13 02:21:30
+***************
+*** 54,63 ****
+ \****************************************************************/
+ CMoveListener::CMoveListener()
+ {
+! _MouseFree = false;
+
+- _CursorInit = false;
+-
+ _Width = 0;
+ _Height = 0;
+
+--- 54,61 ----
+ \****************************************************************/
+ CMoveListener::CMoveListener()
+ {
+! _MouseFree = true;
+
+ _Width = 0;
+ _Height = 0;
+
+***************
+*** 184,190 ****
+ \****************************************************************/
+ void CMoveListener::operator()(const CEvent&amp; event)
+ {
+! static const float eps = 0.001f;
+
+ // Rotation
+ if (event==EventMouseMoveId)
+--- 182,188 ----
+ \****************************************************************/
+ void CMoveListener::operator()(const CEvent&amp; event)
+ {
+! static const float eps = 0.002f;
+
+ // Rotation
+ if (event==EventMouseMoveId)
+***************
+*** 196,240 ****
+
+ if(!_MouseFree)
+ {
+! if(_CursorInit)
+ {
+! float difx = 0.5f-mouseEvent-&gt;X;
+! float dify = -(0.5f-mouseEvent-&gt;Y);
+! if( (float)fabs(difx) &gt; eps || (float)fabs(dify) &gt; eps)
+ {
+! if ( (float)fabs(difx) &gt; eps)
+! {
+! LocalArea-&gt;User.yaw( _RotSpeed*(difx) );
+ }
+! if ( (float)fabs(dify) &gt; eps)
+! {
+! LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch += _RotSpeed*(dify);
+! if(LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch&gt;(float)Pi/2)
+! {
+! LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch = (float)Pi/2;
+! }
+! if(LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch&lt;-(float)Pi/2)
+! {
+! LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch = -(float)Pi/2;
+! }
+ }
+- _Scene-&gt;getDriver()-&gt;setMousePos(0.5,0.5);
+ }
+ }
+- else
+- {
+- _CursorInit = true;
+- _Scene-&gt;getDriver()-&gt;setMousePos(0.5,0.5);
+- }
+ }
+ }
+
+
+
+- // Shoot with left mouse button
+ if ( event==EventMouseDownId)
+ {
+ CEventMouse* mouseEvent=(CEventMouse*)&amp;event;
+ if(mouseEvent-&gt;Button==leftButton &amp;&amp; CanShot)
+ {
+ if ( (ClientSocket!=NULL) &amp;&amp; ClientSocket-&gt;connected() )
+--- 194,230 ----
+
+ if(!_MouseFree)
+ {
+! float difx = _MouseLockX-mouseEvent-&gt;X;
+! float dify = -(_MouseLockY-mouseEvent-&gt;Y);
+! if( (float)fabs(difx) &gt; eps || (float)fabs(dify) &gt; eps)
+ {
+! if ( (float)fabs(difx) &gt; eps)
+! {
+! LocalArea-&gt;User.yaw( _RotSpeed*(difx) );
+! }
+! if ( (float)fabs(dify) &gt; eps)
+ {
+! LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch += _RotSpeed*(dify);
+! if(LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch&gt;(float)Pi/2)
+! {
+! LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch = (float)Pi/2;
+ }
+! if(LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch&lt;-(float)Pi/2)
+! {
+! LocalArea-&gt;User.ViewPitch = -(float)Pi/2;
+ }
+ }
++ _Scene-&gt;getDriver()-&gt;setMousePos(_MouseLockX,_MouseLockY);
+ }
+ }
+ }
+
+
+
+ if ( event==EventMouseDownId)
+ {
+ CEventMouse* mouseEvent=(CEventMouse*)&amp;event;
++ // Shoot with left mouse button
+ if(mouseEvent-&gt;Button==leftButton &amp;&amp; CanShot)
+ {
+ if ( (ClientSocket!=NULL) &amp;&amp; ClientSocket-&gt;connected() )
+***************
+*** 249,254 ****
+--- 239,259 ----
+ }
+ }
+ }
++ if(mouseEvent-&gt;Button==rightButton &amp;&amp; _MouseFree)
++ {
++ _MouseLockX = mouseEvent-&gt;X;
++ _MouseLockY = mouseEvent-&gt;Y;
++ changeControlMode();
++ }
++ }
++
++ if(event==EventMouseUpId)
++ {
++ CEventMouse* mouseEvent=(CEventMouse*)&amp;event;
++ if(mouseEvent-&gt;Button==rightButton &amp;&amp; !_MouseFree)
++ {
++ changeControlMode();
++ }
+ }
+ }
+
+***************
+*** 260,265 ****
+--- 265,271 ----
+ {
+ server.addListener (EventMouseMoveId, this);
+ server.addListener (EventMouseDownId, this);
++ server.addListener (EventMouseUpId, this);
+ }
+
+
+***************
+*** 270,274 ****
+--- 276,281 ----
+ {
+ server.removeListener (EventMouseMoveId, this);
+ server.removeListener (EventMouseDownId, this);
++ server.removeListener (EventMouseUpId, this);
+ }
+
+Index: move_listener.h
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /home/cvsroot/code/client/src/move_listener.h,v
+retrieving revision 1.15
+diff -c -r1.15 move_listener.h
+*** move_listener.h 2001/03/05 09:39:44 1.15
+--- move_listener.h 2001/04/13 02:21:30
+***************
+*** 119,127 ****
+ /// Internal use
+ virtual void operator()(const NLMISC::CEvent&amp; event);
+
+- /// true if first setMousePos done
+- bool _CursorInit;
+-
+ CScene * _Scene;
+
+ /// screen width
+--- 119,124 ----
+***************
+*** 155,160 ****
+--- 152,160 ----
+ float _MouseY;
+
+ bool _Shot;
++
++ float _MouseLockX;
++ float _MouseLockY;
+ };
+
+
+Index: client.cpp
+===================================================================
+RCS file: /home/cvsroot/code/client/src/client.cpp,v
+retrieving revision 1.177
+diff -c -r1.177 client.cpp
+*** client.cpp 2001/04/12 17:06:42 1.177
+--- client.cpp 2001/04/13 02:22:13
+***************
+*** 1880,1893 ****
+ LocalArea-&gt;setEntityMovedCallback( moveEntityInstance );
+ LocalArea-&gt;setEntityRemovedCallback( deleteEntityInstance );
+
+- // hide mouse cursor
+- CNELU::Driver-&gt;showCursor(false);
+- #ifdef NL_RELEASE
+- CNELU::Driver-&gt;setCapture(true);
+- #endif
+-
+-
+-
+ // Load meshes
+ /*
+ vector&lt;string&gt;::iterator itshp;
+--- 1880,1885 ----
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
+ <HR>
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+ right?</A></li>
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+ <H1>[Nel] proposed control changes</H1>
+ <B>Cedric Valignat</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:valignat%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] proposed control changes">valignat@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Fri, 13 Apr 2001 19:41:25 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000400.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A></li>
+ <LI> Next message: <A HREF="000402.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A></li>
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+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Hi,
+
+Dan Erikson wrote:
+&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> I've put together a patch that changes the mouse control in snowballs so
+</I>&gt;<i> that the mouse is normally free, and you have to click on the window
+</I>&gt;<i> and move the mouse in order to move the view around. This is a change
+</I>&gt;<i> from the current behavior where the mouse is always locked by the
+</I>&gt;<i> application. This allows one to use other applications while the game
+</I>&gt;<i> is running. I've even used it to have two instances of snowball running at
+</I>&gt;<i> the same time, which should be useful for testing reasons. It'll also alow
+</I>&gt;<i> for using the mouse in the future for clicking on controls on other parts of
+</I>&gt;<i> the screen. The only thing I'm not sure about is how well it will work on
+</I>&gt;<i> windows. It looks like it'll work, but it would be nice if someone
+</I>&gt;<i> would test it.
+</I>
+Nice :-)
+
+I'm going to take a look on that next week and i will test it on windows
+before to integrate the patch. I will keep you inform of the results :-)
+
+&gt;<i> I used the right mouse button because the left mouse button is already
+</I>&gt;<i> in use
+</I>&gt;<i> for throwing a snowball, but I think these changes to the controls would
+</I>&gt;<i> work better:
+</I>&gt;<i> [...]
+</I>
+The control configuration is a very personal thing, we choose a quite common
+way to configure the moves control ... but it wiil be nice to be able to
+easly configure them :-)
+
+I do agree with you on the Function keys and the ability to be able to use
+the other keys of the keyboard ... migth be nice to have ;-)
+
+
+Thanks for your help,
+
+Cedric.
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000402.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000402.html
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+<HTML>
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+ <TITLE> [Nel] A small document for your consumption</TITLE>
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+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000401.html">
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+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <H1>[Nel] A small document for your consumption</H1>
+ <B>Vincent Archer</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:archer%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] A small document for your consumption">archer@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Fri, 13 Apr 2001 11:34:53 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000401.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A></li>
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+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>While waiting for the whole load, here's a quick and short document. Look
+at it, and critique your hearts out...
+
+Client server connect
+
+This document describes quickly the connection process of a client to a world
+running a NeL-based system.
+
+Abbreviations
+-------------
+
+LS: The login service (one overall)
+WS: The welcome service (one for each world)
+FES: The front-end service (N per world)
+
+Steps
+-----
+
+1: The client initiates a connection to the login service, using the supplied
+ IP and port from the configuration file, with the help of the DNS for IP
+ resolution.
+
+ Note: DNS spoofing or configuration file modification can lead to LS
+ spoofing and hacking of the login/password information of the client.
+ However, DNS is needed for flexibility of the login service location.
+
+2: The client submits its login, password, and system capabilities.
+
+3: The LS checks the login/password validity, and builds the list of all
+ available worlds according to account information and current system
+ settings. This list contains world names and the IP for the WS of that
+ world.
+
+ Note: DNS is not used in that step.
+
+4: The client selects the world it wants to log on, and submits the IP address
+ of its world service to the LS.
+
+5: The LS sends a notification to the selected WS of the client's connection
+ desires. It generates and submits a single-use cookie to validate the
+ incoming connection.
+
+ Note: The cookie includes the client's IP, as seen by the LS (to avoid
+ address translation problems) for validation.
+
+6: The WS selects a FES to accept the client connexion, and submits the cookie
+ to the FES.
+
+7: The FES acknowledges its capacity to accept the client to the WS.
+
+8: The WS acknowledges its capacity to accept the client to the LS, and
+ indicates the IP/port of the selected FES.
+
+9: The LS acknowledges the login request to the client, and indicates the
+ IP/port of the selected FES.
+
+10: The client disconnects from the LS.
+
+11: The client initiates a connection to the indicated FES.
+
+12: The client sends the submitted cookie to the FES.
+
+13: The FES validates and acknowledges the cookie.
+
+Side notes
+----------
+
+Whenever a world starts, the WS establishes a permanent link with the LS,
+using an encrypted link (it is assumed that the LS and WS are located on two
+physically and probably geographically distinct networks). A 'SHARD' message
+serves as authentification, and the WS then updates the LS with its state,
+name and IP address. The WS may have a list of valid IP/port address for WS
+to avoid the occasional pirate server registration.
+
+--
+Vincent Archer Email: <A HREF="mailto:archer@nevrax.com">archer@nevrax.com</A>
+
+Nevrax France. Off on the yellow brick road we go!
+
+</pre>
+
+
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+ <H1>[Nel] A small document for your consumption</H1>
+ <B>Thierry Mallard</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:thierry%40mallard.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] A small document for your consumption">thierry@mallard.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Mon, 16 Apr 2001 21:59:43 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>On Fri, Apr 13, 2001 at 11:34:53AM +0200, Vincent Archer wrote:
+&gt;<i> Steps
+</I>&gt;<i> -----
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> 1: The client initiates a connection to the login service, using the supplied
+</I>&gt;<i> IP and port from the configuration file, with the help of the DNS for IP
+</I>&gt;<i> resolution.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Note: DNS spoofing or configuration file modification can lead to LS
+</I>&gt;<i> spoofing and hacking of the login/password information of the client.
+</I>&gt;<i> However, DNS is needed for flexibility of the login service location.
+</I>
+Possibly this can be partially avoided by providing your own DN Server's IP ?
+(dunno precisly how the client would connect to it, but still...)
+
+&gt;<i> 2: The client submits its login, password, and system capabilities.
+</I>
+In plaintext ?
+
+&gt;<i> 3: The LS checks the login/password validity, and builds the list of all
+</I>&gt;<i> available worlds according to account information and current system
+</I>&gt;<i> settings. This list contains world names and the IP for the WS of that
+</I>&gt;<i> world.
+</I>
+Maybe the use of challenges would be more secure, but i'm not a specialist in
+this matter :-(
+
+&gt;<i> 4: The client selects the world it wants to log on, and submits the IP address
+</I>&gt;<i> of its world service to the LS.
+</I>
+Would it be good if the client could select several worlds ?
+(then the negociation following could use this to get a good WS)
+
+&gt;<i> [...]
+</I>&gt;<i> 10: The client disconnects from the LS.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> 11: The client initiates a connection to the indicated FES.
+</I>
+I wonder if it couldn't be more interesting if the client disconnects from LS
+_after_ having initiated the connection to the FES. Then, if something goes
+wrong, the client could goto 4 directly.
+
+
+Best regards,
+
+--
+Thierry Mallard | <A HREF="http://vawis.net">http://vawis.net</A>
+GnuPG key on wwwkeys.pgp.net | <A HREF="http://erlang-fr.org">http://erlang-fr.org</A> (new)
+key 0xA3D021CB | <A HREF="http://worldforge.org">http://worldforge.org</A>
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+
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+ <H1>[Nel] A small document for your consumption</H1>
+ <B>Thierry Mallard</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:thierry%40mallard.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] A small document for your consumption">thierry@mallard.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Tue, 17 Apr 2001 08:33:31 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>On Fri, Apr 13, 2001 at 11:34:53AM +0200, Vincent Archer wrote:
+&gt;<i> Steps
+</I>&gt;<i> -----
+</I>&gt;<i> [...]
+</I>&gt;<i> 5: The LS sends a notification to the selected WS of the client's connection
+</I>&gt;<i> desires. It generates and submits a single-use cookie to validate the
+</I>&gt;<i> incoming connection.
+</I>
+The LS &lt;--&gt; WS connection should be studied, perhaps ?
+(if it wasn't intended in this document, then let's see that later.. ;-) )
+
+[ *err.. ok i just read the end on the original mail, just forget it* ]
+
+&gt;<i> 6: The WS selects a FES to accept the client connexion, and submits the cookie
+</I>&gt;<i> to the FES.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> 7: The FES acknowledges its capacity to accept the client to the WS.
+</I>
+So the WS is (or can be?) a load-balancer to all the FES in a given world ?
+-- the balancing being done at network level, not process level --
+
+&gt;<i> 8: The WS acknowledges its capacity to accept the client to the LS, and
+</I>&gt;<i> indicates the IP/port of the selected FES.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> 9: The LS acknowledges the login request to the client, and indicates the
+</I>&gt;<i> IP/port of the selected FES.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> 10: The client disconnects from the LS.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> 11: The client initiates a connection to the indicated FES.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> 12: The client sends the submitted cookie to the FES.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> 13: The FES validates and acknowledges the cookie.
+</I>
+IMHO, as said in the other mail, the client should then disconnect from the
+LS ; not before. The downside I see in this case would be the extended time of
+connection (steps 11 et 13), which will lead to more network load. I don't see
+how important that would be.
+
+&gt;<i> Side notes
+</I>&gt;<i> ----------
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Whenever a world starts, the WS establishes a permanent link with the LS,
+</I>&gt;<i> using an encrypted link (it is assumed that the LS and WS are located on two
+</I>&gt;<i> physically and probably geographically distinct networks). A 'SHARD' message
+</I>&gt;<i> serves as authentification, and the WS then updates the LS with its state,
+</I>&gt;<i> name and IP address. The WS may have a list of valid IP/port address for WS
+</I>&gt;<i> to avoid the occasional pirate server registration.
+</I>
+ok, so i should have read the whole document before arguing ;-))
+
+Hope this helps..
+
+--
+Thierry Mallard | <A HREF="http://vawis.net">http://vawis.net</A>
+GnuPG key on wwwkeys.pgp.net | <A HREF="http://erlang-fr.org">http://erlang-fr.org</A> (new)
+key 0xA3D021CB | <A HREF="http://worldforge.org">http://worldforge.org</A>
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+
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+ <H1>[Nel] CVS tree changes</H1>
+ <B>Cedric Valignat</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:valignat%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] CVS tree changes">valignat@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Tue, 17 Apr 2001 18:58:19 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000404.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A></li>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Hello everybody,
+
+We have made some small changement in the CVS tree about Snowballs :
+
+ - a directory &quot;code/snowballs&quot; was created. This directory contain 2
+ subdirectories : &quot;client&quot; &amp; &quot;server&quot;.
+
+ - the &quot;code/client&quot; files were moved to &quot;code/snowballs/client&quot;.
+
+ - the &quot;code/server/moves_service&quot; was moved to &quot;code/snowballs/server/moves_service&quot;.
+
+
+It ws a little mess and we had to clen it up, so as the client directory was
+*only* the snowballs client and the mose_service was used only for running
+a snowballs shard we decided to move these diretories in a more appropriate
+directory.
+
+Some of the txt file were not corrected yet so you migth find them quite
+innacurate ... that will be fixed tomorow ...
+
+Otherwise, the &quot;code/server&quot; directory will be renamed to &quot;code/nelns&quot;
+(standing for NeL Network Service) and will contain our services
+to run a generic shard, services that aren't part of the games
+services but are necessary to run a shard ...
+
+
+Have fune :-)
+
+
+Cedric.
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+
+
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000406.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000406.html
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+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <TITLE> [Nel] CVS code/server renamed to code nelns</TITLE>
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+ <H1>[Nel] CVS code/server renamed to code nelns</H1>
+ <B>Cedric Valignat</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:valignat%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] CVS code/server renamed to code nelns">valignat@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Wed, 18 Apr 2001 18:59:08 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000410.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A></li>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Hello,
+
+As i told about in my preceding mail, the CVS code/server directory was renamed
+to code nelns (standing for NeL Network Services).
+
+So you will get that new structure from tonigth CVS synchronization ...
+
+
+Have a good time ...
+
+
+Cedric.
+
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+
+
+
+
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+ <H1>[Nel] A small document for your consumption</H1>
+ <B>Vincent Archer</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:archer%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] A small document for your consumption">archer@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Tue, 17 Apr 2001 12:27:13 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>I'll answer both posts at the same time...
+
+According to Thierry Mallard:
+&gt;<i> Possibly this can be partially avoided by providing your own DN Server's IP ?
+</I>&gt;<i> (dunno precisly how the client would connect to it, but still...)
+</I>
+There are two ways you can find out a server:
+
+1) Hardcode the IP address (then, you cannot move the server)
+2) Use DNS for dynamic IP (then, the hardcoded address is the root of the
+ DNS tree - which, hopefully, changes even less often than we will)
+
+You can't specify your &quot;own DNS&quot;. Using that is basically the same as
+using method 1: you still have to put a server at a static IP that gives
+you off the dynamic IP.
+
+&gt;<i> &gt; 2: The client submits its login, password, and system capabilities.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> In plaintext ?
+</I>
+If we assume the link has a crypt method in it, why not.
+
+Three possible methods for password submission
+
+1) Plaintext, assuming the connection has a form of crypt in place
+2) MD5/crypt password. Spoofable, since:
+ a) You can capture the MD5/crypt string
+ b) You have the client source, so can hack it to send the static
+ crypted password instead of crypting the - unknown - plaintext
+3) MD5 for a dynamic challenge. A good example: the server sends you the
+ current date when you connect, and you use that date as the first
+ bytes of the MD5 digest.
+
+&gt;<i> &gt; 4: The client selects the world it wants to log on, and submits the IP address
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; of its world service to the LS.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Would it be good if the client could select several worlds ?
+</I>&gt;<i> (then the negociation following could use this to get a good WS)
+</I>
+Not good. Typically, the client will connect to the world the player has
+a character he wants to play today :)
+
+However, the client may use the IP addresses of the WS to ping them and
+figure out which connection is better (when selecting its first world).
+
+&gt;<i> So the WS is (or can be?) a load-balancer to all the FES in a given world ?
+</I>&gt;<i> -- the balancing being done at network level, not process level --
+</I>
+The WS *is* the load balancing mechanism. Since he's aware of all FES
+up and running, and knows their load right now, he's best suited to
+determine which FES can afford to manage a new character.
+
+&gt;<i> I wonder if it couldn't be more interesting if the client disconnects from LS
+</I>&gt;<i> _after_ having initiated the connection to the FES. Then, if something goes
+</I>&gt;<i> wrong, the client could goto 4 directly.
+</I>
+Hmmm, that might be good, yes.
+
+--
+Vincent Archer Email: <A HREF="mailto:archer@nevrax.com">archer@nevrax.com</A>
+
+Nevrax France. Off on the yellow brick road we go!
+
+</pre>
+
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000408.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000408.html
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+ <H1>[Nel] NeL Status Update?</H1>
+ <B>EagleEye</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:eagleeye%40flashmail.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] NeL Status Update?">eagleeye@flashmail.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Tue, 17 Apr 2001 14:10:03 -0500</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
+
+------=_NextPart_000_0118_01C0C748.1901E060
+Content-Type: text/plain;
+ charset=&quot;iso-8859-1&quot;
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+
+My game project has gotten to the point where I am ready to start =
+putting the world together, and doing some logic/AI scripting and such. =
+The problem is, I have no idea how the data structure works for NeL, and =
+we still have no access to the 3D Studio plugin that NeL needs for it's =
+textures.
+
+Is there any way I can get an ETA on that 3DS plugin, and detailed =
+documentation of how to structure the data for my world, so NeL will =
+work with it?
+
+Thanks,
+
+Jared Mark
+
+------=_NextPart_000_0118_01C0C748.1901E060
+Content-Type: text/html;
+ charset=&quot;iso-8859-1&quot;
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+
+&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC &quot;-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN&quot;&gt;
+&lt;HTML&gt;&lt;HEAD&gt;
+&lt;META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D&quot;text/html; =
+charset=3Diso-8859-1&quot;&gt;
+&lt;META content=3D&quot;MSHTML 5.50.4522.1801&quot; name=3DGENERATOR&gt;
+&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;
+&lt;/HEAD&gt;
+&lt;BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT size=3D2&gt;My game project has gotten to the point where I am =
+ready to=20
+start putting the world together, and doing some logic/AI scripting and=20
+such.&amp;nbsp; The problem is, I have no idea how the data structure works =
+for NeL,=20
+and we still have no access to the 3D Studio plugin that NeL needs for =
+it's=20
+textures.&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT size=3D2&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT size=3D2&gt;Is there any way I can get an ETA on that 3DS =
+plugin,=20
+and&amp;nbsp;detailed documentation of how to structure the data for my =
+world, so=20
+NeL will work with it?&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT size=3D2&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT size=3D2&gt;Thanks,&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT size=3D2&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT size=3D2&gt;Jared Mark&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;&lt;/BODY&gt;&lt;/HTML&gt;
+
+------=_NextPart_000_0118_01C0C748.1901E060--
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
+ <HR>
+ <P><UL>
+ <!--threads-->
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000409.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000409.html
new file mode 100644
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+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:zager%40teleaction.com">
+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000408.html">
+ <LINK REL="Next" HREF="000410.html">
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <H1>[Nel] NeL Status Update?</H1>
+ <B>Dim Segebart</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:zager%40teleaction.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] NeL Status Update?">zager@teleaction.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Thu, 19 Apr 2001 14:55:25 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000408.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A></li>
+ <LI> Next message: <A HREF="000410.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A></li>
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+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>E&gt; My game project has gotten to the point where I am ready to start putting the world together, and doing some logic/AI scripting and such. The problem is, I have no idea how the data structure
+E&gt; works for NeL, and we still have no access to the 3D Studio plugin that NeL needs for it's textures.
+
+E&gt; Is there any way I can get an ETA on that 3DS plugin, and detailed documentation of how to structure the data for my world, so NeL will work with it?
+
+As I noted earlier, IMHO the best solution for all of us, will be open
+format of NeL's data files and accompanying stuff. In such a case we
+will be free to write converters from our favorite 3D tools XYZ to the NeL
+format. But I can predict changes in format of NeL files to extend the
+current set of features. Just like DWG file format was always closed
+to the most of us and was subject of permanent changes, DXF file format was opened to everyone, so I'm
+offer not too stick to the current implementation of NeL's binary file
+format, but just invent some formal data format which will be the same for NeL as DXF
+is for DWG (let's name it NFF - NelFileFormat). In such a case Nevrax team create translator
+from NFF to the internal representation and the people outside the
+Nevrax create translator from format XYZ to the NFF. With addition of
+new features and other format changes Nevrax make changes to the
+NFF2INTERNAL and we make changes to the XYZ2NFF As a consequence of
+such a decision Nevrax will be free to change internal stuff without
+breaking users world's data and users always can store their data in
+some intermediate format. Just imagine the situation. Nevrax add new
+really cool features to the game and release new internal file format
+with new release of engine. What happen with users worlds which are
+incompatible with new version ? I think you may guess ;)
+But if along with a new version Nevrax will release a new version of
+converter NFF2INTERNAL the problem will be solved. This converter takes
+care about all internal changes and user's data will be on-line again
+within short period of time.
+
+What's about standard XML as a basement? :)
+
+--
+Dim Segebart
+
+PS. May be I'm completely wrong and Nevrax team has a better
+solution?
+
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
+ <HR>
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+ <!--threads-->
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000410.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000410.html
new file mode 100644
index 00000000..03c5f96e
--- /dev/null
+++ b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000410.html
@@ -0,0 +1,312 @@
+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <TITLE> [Nel] NeL Status Update?</TITLE>
+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:corvazier%40nevrax.com">
+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000409.html">
+ <LINK REL="Next" HREF="000406.html">
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <H1>[Nel] NeL Status Update?</H1>
+ <B>Cyril Corvazier</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:corvazier%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] NeL Status Update?">corvazier@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Fri, 20 Apr 2001 19:06:03 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000409.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A></li>
+ <LI> Next message: <A HREF="000406.html">[Nel] CVS code/server renamed to code nelns</A></li>
+ <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B>
+ <a href="date.html#410">[ date ]</a>
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+ </LI>
+ </UL>
+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Hi,
+
+&gt;<i> E&gt; Is there any way I can get an ETA on that 3DS plugin, and detailed
+</I>documentation of how to structure the data for my world, so NeL will work
+with it?
+
+What you said about the NeL file format makes a lot of sense, and it match
+what we planned to do in a near future.
+
+Actually, i'm going to describe the current data management.
+
+Today, our export plug-ins generate NeL binary files using the NeL
+serialisation system.
+The serialisation system is described in the document inserted at the end of
+the mail. This document
+will be available on the web site in the Doxygen Related Pages during the
+next week.
+
+Here is the URL of another document that describes how to build NeL 3d data
+from your 3d editor and export them in NeL binary format:
+
+<A HREF="http://www.nevrax.org/docs/doxygen/nel/3d_data_howto.html">http://www.nevrax.org/docs/doxygen/nel/3d_data_howto.html</A>
+
+---
+
+NeL Files and Serialisation
+
+* Introduction
+
+This is really quite a difficult subject to write about - so this file is an
+introduction which describes the basic features and principles of our
+system.
+
+
+* How our files work in NeL
+
+The NeL files are NOT designed to be man-readable. Interpretation and
+generation of file contents is performed by the objects that are to be read
+and written using a standardised mechanism. This mechanism was inspired by
+the system provided by Java.
+
+We use the term 'serialisable' to describe a class that can be read from/
+written to a NeL data file.
+Counter-intuitive as it may, at first, appear, each 'serialisable' class
+supplies a single method that is used for both reading and writing.
+
+Note that the files are encoded in little-endian and that the NeL library
+code deals with conversion of endian-ness for big-endian platforms
+
+
+* Serialisation beyond files
+
+The serialisation system can be used for generating binary data buffers in
+memory (without writing the result to a file) or for packing and unpacking
+data for transfer over a LAN.
+
+
+* How it works
+
+Technically, we define a 'serialisable' class as a class that can be passed
+to IStream::serial().
+In order for a class to be serialisable it is sufficient for it to include
+the following method:
+ void serial(IStream&amp;).
+The fact that we use a template method definition means that a serialisable
+class does not have to be derived from any other class.
+All standard types are serialisable due to a non-template prototypes shown
+below.
+STL containers of serialisable types are serialisadble
+Pointers to non-polymorphic serialisable types are serialisable.
+
+The IStream class definition looks something like this:
+
+ class IStream
+ {
+ ...
+ void serial (int&amp;);
+ void serial (float&amp;);
+ ...
+ template &lt;class T&gt; void serial (T&amp;t)
+ {
+ t.serial (*this);
+ }
+ };
+
+
+Example:
+To make the following class serialisable:
+
+ class myFirstClass
+ {
+ int a,b;
+ };
+
+you would need to extend the class as follows:
+
+ class myFirstClass
+ {
+ int a,b;
+ void serial (IStream&amp;istream)
+ {
+ istream.serial(a);
+ istream.serial(b);
+ }
+ };
+
+The following example shows how to serialise a more complicated data
+structure
+
+ class myFirstClass
+ {
+ void serial (IStream&amp;);
+ };
+
+ class myclass
+ {
+ int BaseType;
+ myFirstClass SerialisableClass
+ std::vector&lt; myFirstClass&gt; STLContainerOfSerialisableClass;
+ myFirstClass *PointerToSerialisableClass;
+ std::vector&lt; myFirstClass*&gt; STLContainerOfPointersToSerialisableClass;
+
+ void serial (IStream&amp;istream)
+ {
+ istream.serial(BaseType);
+ istream.serial(SerialisableClass);
+ istream.serialCont(STLContainerOfSerialisableClass);
+ istream.serialPtr(PointerToSerialisableClass);
+ istream.serialContPtr(STLContainerOfPointersToSerialisableClass);
+ }
+ };
+
+
+
+* Dealing with cross referenced or hierarchical data
+
+If an object contains a pointer to another object in memory then the
+serialPtr() method is used to read/ write the referenced object.
+The NeL library code writes a value corresponding to the pointer to the
+serialised data, followed by the data that the pointer points to (In the
+case of a NULL pointer the value 0 is written without any following data)
+The NeL library code automatically deals with the cases where two or more
+objects reference the same object or there is a circular reference. Each
+time a pointer is de-referenced, for writing, NeL checks against a table of
+previous pointers; if the pointer value already exists in the table then no
+data is written. At read time the data structures are faithfully
+reconstructed.
+
+
+* Dealing with polymorphism within cross referenced data
+
+In a nut shell, in order to un-serialise a data record that one only has an
+interface type for, one needs to store an additional identifier with the
+data record that identifies it's real type. The mechanism for doing this is
+best shown with an example:
+
+ class IBaseClass : public IStreamable
+ {
+ // This class is an interface. It is polymorphic.
+ virtual void foo ()=0;
+
+ // It must declare it's name
+ NLMISC_DECLARE_CLASS (MyClass);
+ };
+
+ class CClassToSerialise
+ {
+ IBaseClass *PointerToAPolymorphicClass;
+
+ void serial (IStream&amp; s)
+ {
+ s.serialPolyPtr (PointerToAPolymorphicClass);
+ }
+ };
+
+ void main ()
+ {
+ ...
+ // The polymorphic class must be registered in the registry
+ NLMISC_REGISTER_CLASS (MyClass);
+ ...
+ }
+
+
+* Dealing with file format evolution
+
+ void serial (IStream&amp; s)
+ {
+ // At the begining of the serial process, read/ write the version number
+of the class implementation
+
+ // In the following example - at read time 'version' contains the version
+read from the stream. At
+ // write time version code '3' is written to the stream and to the
+variable 'version'.
+ int version=s.serialVersion (3);
+
+ // Now switch the version
+ switch (version)
+ {
+ case 3:
+ // The last field added in the class
+ s.serial (LastField);
+
+ // do some different stuff at read time and write time
+ if (s.isReading())
+ {
+ // at read time
+ ...
+ }
+ else
+ {
+ // at write time
+ ...
+ }
+
+ case 2:
+ // note that the code provided as of here allows for the reading of old
+versions of the class
+
+ s.serial (Toto);
+
+ // in the case where the evolution from my version 1 implementation to my
+version 2
+ // is not simply an extension of version 1 we need to break execution
+here
+ break;
+
+ case 1:
+ s.serial (Foo);
+ case 0:
+ s.serial (Truc);
+ }
+
+ }
+
+
+* NeL File Headers
+
+The objective of NeL file headers is to verify that a file is in the right
+format before attempting to interpret the contents.
+
+ // The NeL team use the following advise serialise a file this way:
+ void CFileRootClass::serial (IStream&amp; s)
+ {
+ // First write / read-check the header
+ s.serialCheck ((uint32)'_LEN');
+ s.serialCheck ((uint32)'HSEM');
+
+ // This code write / read-check the header 'NEL_MESH' at the beginning of
+the file.
+ // If the check fails, serialCheck throws the EInvalidDataStream
+exception.
+ }
+
+* Good examples to look at:
+
+ include/nel/misc/stream.h // Stream base classes
+ class CTileBank in src/3d/tile_bank.cpp // Good example of file format
+evolution
+ class CAnimation in src/3d/animation.cpp // Good example of polymorphism
+
+
+---
+Cyril Corvazier
+Lead 3d programmer
+Nevrax France
+
+
+</pre>
+
+<!--endarticle-->
+ <HR>
+ <P><UL>
+ <!--threads-->
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+</body></html>
diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000412.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000412.html
new file mode 100644
index 00000000..61445ed5
--- /dev/null
+++ b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/000412.html
@@ -0,0 +1,162 @@
+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <TITLE> [Nel] 3dsmax 3.1 plug-ins</TITLE>
+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:corvazier%40nevrax.com">
+ <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="000413.html">
+
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <H1>[Nel] 3dsmax 3.1 plug-ins</H1>
+ <B>Cyril Corvazier</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:corvazier%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] 3dsmax 3.1 plug-ins">corvazier@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Thu, 26 Apr 2001 19:56:44 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
+ <LI> Previous message: <A HREF="000413.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A></li>
+
+ <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B>
+ <a href="date.html#412">[ date ]</a>
+ <a href="thread.html#412">[ thread ]</a>
+ <a href="subject.html#412">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#412">[ author ]</a>
+ </LI>
+ </UL>
+ <HR>
+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
+
+------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C0CE8B.05058E00
+Content-Type: text/plain;
+ charset=&quot;iso-8859-1&quot;
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+
+Hi,
+
+The good news:
+
+We have released the source code of some of our plug-ins for 3dsmax 3.1.
+
+The sources available are:
+
+* Scene exporter plug-in. Export NeL binary meshes, animations, skeleton =
+etc..
+* Patch converter plug-in. Convert a 3dsmax PatchMesh in a NeLPatchMesh.
+* TileUtility plug-in. Use tile banks in 3dsmax.
+
+You can find thoses plugins in the CVS tree in nel/tools/3d/plugins_max
+
+The bad news:
+
+1) One of our plugin, the landscape painter, is not in this package =
+because it is based=20
+on Discreet EditPatch source code, and we can't distribute this modified =
+source code.
+
+2) Given that Max plug-ins are linked to the 3DSMax SDK (which is not =
+Gnu GPL)=20
+and to NeL (which is Gnu GPL), anyone distributing plug-ins in binary =
+form will be in=20
+breach of the Gnu GPL.
+
+In English than means that you shouldn't distribute the plug-ins as =
+binaries.
+You are, of course, free to distribute the source code.
+
+Regards,
+Cyril Corvazier
+Lead 3d programmer
+Nevrax France
+
+
+
+------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C0CE8B.05058E00
+Content-Type: text/html;
+ charset=&quot;iso-8859-1&quot;
+Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+
+&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC &quot;-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN&quot;&gt;
+&lt;HTML&gt;&lt;HEAD&gt;
+&lt;META content=3D&quot;text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1&quot; =
+http-equiv=3DContent-Type&gt;
+&lt;META content=3D&quot;MSHTML 5.00.2919.6307&quot; name=3DGENERATOR&gt;
+&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;
+&lt;/HEAD&gt;
+&lt;BODY bgColor=3D#c8bcb0&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;Hi,&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;The good news:&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;We have released the source code of =
+some of our=20
+plug-ins for 3dsmax 3.1.&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;The sources available are:&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;* Scene exporter plug-in. Export NeL =
+binary meshes,=20
+animations, skeleton etc..&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;* Patch converter plug-in. Convert a =
+3dsmax=20
+PatchMesh in a NeLPatchMesh.&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;* TileUtility plug-in. Use tile banks =
+in=20
+3dsmax.&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;You can find thoses plugins in the CVS =
+tree in=20
+nel/tools/3d/plugins_max&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;The bad news:&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;1) One of our plugin, the landscape =
+painter, is not=20
+in this package because it is based &lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;on Discreet EditPatch source code, and =
+we can't=20
+distribute this modified source code.&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;2) Given that Max plug-ins are linked =
+to the 3DSMax=20
+SDK (which is not Gnu GPL) &lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;and to NeL (which is Gnu GPL), anyone =
+distributing=20
+plug-ins in binary form will be in &lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;breach of the Gnu GPL.&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;In English than means that you =
+shouldn't distribute=20
+the plug-ins as binaries.&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;You are, of course, free to distribute =
+the source=20
+code.&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;Regards,&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;
+&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;FONT face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;
+&lt;P class=3DMsoNormal&gt;&lt;FONT color=3Dblack face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;&lt;SPAN=20
+style=3D&quot;COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt&quot;&gt;Cyril=20
+Corvazier&lt;BR&gt;Lead 3d programmer&lt;BR&gt;Nevrax =
+France&lt;BR&gt;&lt;/SPAN&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;FONT=20
+face=3DArial size=3D2&gt;&lt;/P&gt;&lt;/FONT&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;&lt;/BODY&gt;&lt;/HTML&gt;
+
+------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C0CE8B.05058E00--
+
+
+</pre>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
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+ <H1>[Nel] A small document for your consumption</H1>
+ <B>Vincent Archer</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:archer%40nevrax.com"
+ TITLE="[Nel] A small document for your consumption">archer@nevrax.com</A><BR>
+ <I>Fri, 27 Apr 2001 17:15:17 +0200</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>According to Brenden Towey:
+&gt;<i> From: Vincent Archer &lt;<A HREF="mailto:archer@nevrax.com">archer@nevrax.com</A>&gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; 3) MD5 for a dynamic challenge. A good example: the server sends you the
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; current date when you connect, and you use that date as the first
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; bytes of the MD5 digest.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Would #3 solve the login &amp; password hacking problem?
+</I>
+More or less. However, most of the hacking problems I've seen these days
+on MMOGs do not involve a spoofed server or anything else. They're all
+revolving around:
+
+1) A scam aimed at getting your login and password
+ (we have this incredible powerleveling service. Send us $30 and
+ your password and we'll have you level 50 in a month)
+
+2) A trojan (last one on EQ pretending to be an 'undetectable macro
+ program') that intercept the login/password pair when you *type them*.
+
+Still, it doesn't hurt to make a MD5 challenge. If someone can spoof
+you into believing you're talking to the server, the usual crypto layer
+that protects your connection against sniffing will not protect your
+password (something some web designers conveniently forget, saying that
+once you're using https:// urls, you can send you password in clear to
+the web).
+
+&gt;<i> &gt;serves as authentification, and the WS then updates the LS with its state,
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;name and IP address. The WS may have a list of valid IP/port address for WS
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;to avoid the occasional pirate server registration.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Ok, I don't understand this. Why would one person or company want to do
+</I>&gt;<i> this? What's the advantage to having a login service in one location and a
+</I>&gt;<i> world service in another? Why not just co-locate all your services behind
+</I>&gt;<i> one firewall?
+</I>
+Bandwidth/Lag/Security issues.
+
+Bandwidth is the first, and usually the less important one. But when you
+start talking multiple OC12 links for your bandwidth consumption, you
+quickly have limits on where you can locate your worlds. It is a lot easier
+to negociate several locations with OC4 for each than say &quot;I need a place
+with two OC12&quot;.
+
+Lag is another one. All the world is not the states... tell it to the Aussies
+who ranted and screamed till they finally got one Ultima Online server
+down under. We're doing our best to make lag irrelevant, but given the
+choice of playing on a server with 500 ms ping and a server with 100 ms
+ping times... The experience with the latter will always be a *lot*
+smoother.
+
+And finally security. Not network security, I'm talking real security.
+Despite every premium paid, what happens if your server room catches
+fire, and despite generous smothering of Halon, all your servers are
+burnt to a nice crispy taste? Sure, the insurance will pay you lots of
+money. But your players will no longer be there.
+
+Spreading your servers around makes sense on several points.
+
+--
+Vincent Archer Email: <A HREF="mailto:archer@nevrax.com">archer@nevrax.com</A>
+
+Nevrax France. Off on the yellow brick road we go!
+
+</pre>
+
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+ <a name="start"></A>
+ <h1>2001-April Archives by Author</h1>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+
+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p><b>Starting:</b> <i>Thu Apr 5 18:19:11 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Ending:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Messages:</b> 22<p>
+ <ul>
+
+<LI> <A HREF="000398.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="398"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000402.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="402"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000407.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="407"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000413.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="413"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000392.html">[Nel] Subscribe Me</A> <A NAME="392"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000393.html">[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</A> <A NAME="393"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000410.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="410"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000412.html">[Nel] 3dsmax 3.1 plug-ins</A> <A NAME="412"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000408.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="408"></A><I>EagleEye</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000400.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="400"></A><I>Dan Erikson</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000403.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="403"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000404.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="404"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000396.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="396"></A><I>David Mentre</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000397.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="397"></A><I>sameh chafik Pro</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000409.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="409"></A><I>Dim Segebart</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000411.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="411"></A><I>Brenden Towey</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000395.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="395"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000401.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="401"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000405.html">[Nel] CVS tree changes</A> <A NAME="405"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000406.html">[Nel] CVS code/server renamed to code nelns</A> <A NAME="406"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000394.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="394"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000399.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about,
+ right?</A> <A NAME="399"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <a name="end"><b>Last message date:</b></a>
+ <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Archived on:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 17:28:02 2001</i>
+ <p>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
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+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
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+ <hr>
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+
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+ <a name="start"></A>
+ <h1>2001-April Archives by Date</h1>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
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+
+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p><b>Starting:</b> <i>Thu Apr 5 18:19:11 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Ending:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Messages:</b> 22<p>
+ <ul>
+
+<LI> <A HREF="000392.html">[Nel] Subscribe Me</A> <A NAME="392"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000393.html">[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</A> <A NAME="393"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000394.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="394"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000395.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="395"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000396.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="396"></A><I>David Mentre</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000397.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="397"></A><I>sameh chafik Pro</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000398.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="398"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000399.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about,
+ right?</A> <A NAME="399"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000400.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="400"></A><I>Dan Erikson</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000402.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="402"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000401.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="401"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000403.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="403"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000404.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="404"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000407.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="407"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000405.html">[Nel] CVS tree changes</A> <A NAME="405"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000408.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="408"></A><I>EagleEye</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000406.html">[Nel] CVS code/server renamed to code nelns</A> <A NAME="406"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000409.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="409"></A><I>Dim Segebart</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000410.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="410"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000411.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="411"></A><I>Brenden Towey</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000412.html">[Nel] 3dsmax 3.1 plug-ins</A> <A NAME="412"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000413.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="413"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <a name="end"><b>Last message date:</b></a>
+ <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Archived on:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 17:28:02 2001</i>
+ <p>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
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+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
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diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/index.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/index.html
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+ <title>The Nel 2001-April Archive by Thread</title>
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <a name="start"></A>
+ <h1>2001-April Archives by Thread</h1>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+
+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p><b>Starting:</b> <i>Thu Apr 5 18:19:11 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Ending:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Messages:</b> 22<p>
+ <ul>
+
+<!--0 00986487551- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000392.html">[Nel] Subscribe Me</A> <A NAME="1302"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<!--0 00986491457- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000393.html">[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</A> <A NAME="1303"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<!--0 00986741273- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000394.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1304"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00986741273-00986831573- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000395.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1305"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<UL>
+<!--2 00986741273-00986831573-00986883461- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000396.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1306"></A><I>David Mentre</I>
+<UL>
+<!--3 00986741273-00986831573-00986883461-00986909706- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000398.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1308"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+</UL>
+</UL>
+<!--1 00986741273-00986886108- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000397.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1307"></A><I>sameh chafik Pro</I>
+<UL>
+<!--2 00986741273-00986886108-00986938501- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000399.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about,
+ right?</A> <A NAME="1309"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+</UL>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00987126558- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000400.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="1310"></A><I>Dan Erikson</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00987126558-00987180085- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000401.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="1311"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00987150893- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000402.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1312"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00987150893-00987447583- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000403.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1313"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+<UL>
+<!--2 00987150893-00987447583-00987499633- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000407.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1317"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+</UL>
+<!--1 00987150893-00987485611- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000404.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1314"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00987523099- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000405.html">[Nel] CVS tree changes</A> <A NAME="1315"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<!--0 00987531003- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000408.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="1318"></A><I>EagleEye</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00987531003-00987681325- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000409.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="1319"></A><I>Dim Segebart</I>
+<UL>
+<!--2 00987531003-00987681325-00987782763- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000410.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="1320"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+</UL>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00987609548- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000406.html">[Nel] CVS code/server renamed to code nelns</A> <A NAME="1316"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<!--0 00988294812- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000411.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1321"></A><I>Brenden Towey</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00988294812-00988380917- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000413.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1323"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00988304204- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000412.html">[Nel] 3dsmax 3.1 plug-ins</A> <A NAME="1322"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <a name="end"><b>Last message date:</b></a>
+ <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Archived on:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 17:28:02 2001</i>
+ <p>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
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+ <title>The Nel 2001-April Archive by Subject</title>
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+ <a name="start"></A>
+ <h1>2001-April Archives by Subject</h1>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+
+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p><b>Starting:</b> <i>Thu Apr 5 18:19:11 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Ending:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Messages:</b> 22<p>
+ <ul>
+
+<LI> <A HREF="000412.html">[Nel] 3dsmax 3.1 plug-ins</A> <A NAME="412"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000402.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="402"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000403.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="403"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000404.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="404"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000407.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="407"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000411.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="411"></A><I>Brenden Towey</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000413.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="413"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000406.html">[Nel] CVS code/server renamed to code nelns</A> <A NAME="406"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000405.html">[Nel] CVS tree changes</A> <A NAME="405"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000393.html">[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</A> <A NAME="393"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000408.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="408"></A><I>EagleEye</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000409.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="409"></A><I>Dim Segebart</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000410.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="410"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000400.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="400"></A><I>Dan Erikson</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000401.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="401"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000392.html">[Nel] Subscribe Me</A> <A NAME="392"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000399.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about,
+ right?</A> <A NAME="399"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000394.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="394"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000395.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="395"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000396.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="396"></A><I>David Mentre</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000397.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="397"></A><I>sameh chafik Pro</I>
+<LI> <A HREF="000398.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="398"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <a name="end"><b>Last message date:</b></a>
+ <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Archived on:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 17:28:02 2001</i>
+ <p>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <hr>
+ <i>This archive was generated by
+ Pipermail 0.05 (Mailman edition).</i>
+ </BODY>
+</HTML>
+
diff --git a/pipermail/nel/2001-April/thread.html b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/thread.html
new file mode 100644
index 00000000..25407f43
--- /dev/null
+++ b/pipermail/nel/2001-April/thread.html
@@ -0,0 +1,110 @@
+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <title>The Nel 2001-April Archive by Thread</title>
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <a name="start"></A>
+ <h1>2001-April Archives by Thread</h1>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+
+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p><b>Starting:</b> <i>Thu Apr 5 18:19:11 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Ending:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Messages:</b> 22<p>
+ <ul>
+
+<!--0 00986487551- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000392.html">[Nel] Subscribe Me</A> <A NAME="1302"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<!--0 00986491457- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000393.html">[Nel] Mark Ewert ewert@reflexnet.net</A> <A NAME="1303"></A><I>Brandon</I>
+<!--0 00986741273- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000394.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1304"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00986741273-00986831573- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000395.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1305"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<UL>
+<!--2 00986741273-00986831573-00986883461- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000396.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1306"></A><I>David Mentre</I>
+<UL>
+<!--3 00986741273-00986831573-00986883461-00986909706- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000398.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1308"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+</UL>
+</UL>
+<!--1 00986741273-00986886108- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000397.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about, right?</A> <A NAME="1307"></A><I>sameh chafik Pro</I>
+<UL>
+<!--2 00986741273-00986886108-00986938501- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000399.html">[Nel] You guys will let us know when you're done mucking about,
+ right?</A> <A NAME="1309"></A><I>robert@thatsnice.org</I>
+</UL>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00987126558- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000400.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="1310"></A><I>Dan Erikson</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00987126558-00987180085- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000401.html">[Nel] proposed control changes</A> <A NAME="1311"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00987150893- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000402.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1312"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00987150893-00987447583- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000403.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1313"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+<UL>
+<!--2 00987150893-00987447583-00987499633- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000407.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1317"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+</UL>
+<!--1 00987150893-00987485611- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000404.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1314"></A><I>Thierry Mallard</I>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00987523099- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000405.html">[Nel] CVS tree changes</A> <A NAME="1315"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<!--0 00987531003- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000408.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="1318"></A><I>EagleEye</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00987531003-00987681325- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000409.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="1319"></A><I>Dim Segebart</I>
+<UL>
+<!--2 00987531003-00987681325-00987782763- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000410.html">[Nel] NeL Status Update?</A> <A NAME="1320"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+</UL>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00987609548- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000406.html">[Nel] CVS code/server renamed to code nelns</A> <A NAME="1316"></A><I>Cedric Valignat</I>
+<!--0 00988294812- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000411.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1321"></A><I>Brenden Towey</I>
+<UL>
+<!--1 00988294812-00988380917- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000413.html">[Nel] A small document for your consumption</A> <A NAME="1323"></A><I>Vincent Archer</I>
+</UL>
+<!--0 00988304204- -->
+<LI> <A HREF="000412.html">[Nel] 3dsmax 3.1 plug-ins</A> <A NAME="1322"></A><I>Cyril Corvazier</I>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <a name="end"><b>Last message date:</b></a>
+ <i>Fri Apr 27 16:15:17 2001</i><br>
+ <b>Archived on:</b> <i>Fri Apr 27 17:28:02 2001</i>
+ <p>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+ <li><b><a href="http://www.nevrax.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/nel">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <hr>
+ <i>This archive was generated by
+ Pipermail 0.05 (Mailman edition).</i>
+ </BODY>
+</HTML>
+